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Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

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  • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

    Regarding copies. Has anybody made them work?

    Maybe we need to record in PTP mode....

    Comment


    • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

      Originally posted by papars View Post
      Ha ha!
      Yes, I think it runs windows automotive 5.0
      If you have the latest telematic disk (1.10) in the directory \HU25\093000\A001902\5600_001 you will find the system image files (nk.bin nk2.bin) that are copied to the HDD during telematics update.
      The HU boots from flash, cpu seems to be SH4.
      Somebody with knowledge can decompress the files and possibly make modifications.
      Don't know how big the .bin files are, but could you upload them somewhere? (I don't have the telematics disc, you see). Maybe it is possible to "dump" or decompile the nk.bin file with some tools found on forum.xda-developer.com

      Comment


      • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

        You can decompile the bin files using the usual microsoft or other tools find on the net. What I see as problem is how to force the unit to load these (modified) files without using DAS as is now. I suspect it might be possible using the hidden menu but it needs alot of reverse engineering or inside info.

        The files aren't big about 80Mb total. You can find the telematics iso in this forum somewhere and then mount the iso to read them. But this is not the scope of this thread.

        Regarding copy and image making of the map disks.
        The original disks are pressed in PTP mode. Use DVDInfoPro to see what I mean.
        This means that every copy made to OPT media is useless because there seems to be a copy protection that checks the layer brake position and maybe some other stuff.
        ALL DVD+R DL disks are OPT. So forget every recording made to +R DL disks is simply not going to work.

        I have no knowledge and can't make heads or tails about DVD-R disks from what I read on the net. In any case it seems there might be DVD-R disks that are PTP and these need special DVD recorders or / and software that knows how to handle the PTP disks correctly. [In playstations and other game machines, they use mod chips to force the units to read copied disks.]

        One more thing I notice.
        If you have old map, e.g. 1.0 and you upgrade the telematics then you can't load 1.1 or 3.0. You need to go straight to 4.1 because older maps needed older firmware to work. The stupid HU does not give you the correct message (about firmware mismatch) and just tells you to contact MB. IF you connect DAS then it will suggest the correct next update based on the telematcs installed on the HU.

        Comment


        • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

          Originally posted by appelflap View Post
          Don't know how big the .bin files are, but could you upload them somewhere? (I don't have the telematics disc, you see). Maybe it is possible to "dump" or decompile the nk.bin file with some tools found on forum.xda-developer.com
          Do not play around (unless it is your hobby )
          Re-inventing the wheel did not help anybody. Update can be done easily with the telematics disc. Map updating is the real problem which we all in this thread are trying to tackle !! Isn't it ??
          Get the telematics disc my friend it is available in many places, among which is this forum
          Last edited by gmatj; 5th June 2010, 09:35.

          Comment


          • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

            Originally posted by gmatj View Post
            Do not play around (unless it is your hobby )
            Re-inventing the wheel did not help anybody. Update can be done easily with the telematics disc. Map updating is the real problem which we all in this thread are trying to tackle !! Isn't it ??
            Get the telematics disc my friend it is available in many places, among which is this forum
            His idea is about hacking the telematics, not to make the update without DAS ...

            Comment


            • Comment


              • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                Originally posted by papars View Post
                You can decompile the bin files using the usual microsoft or other tools find on the net. What I see as problem is how to force the unit to load these (modified) files without using DAS as is now. I suspect it might be possible using the hidden menu but it needs alot of reverse engineering or inside info.

                The files aren't big about 80Mb total. You can find the telematics iso in this forum somewhere and then mount the iso to read them. But this is not the scope of this thread.
                ...
                Thanks, I've dumped the bin file. You're right, it is ce 5.0 (old system btw). I'm gonna play with it and see what else the comand aps can do.
                BTW i've dumped the bin files in the 5700_01 directory, not the 5600_01 dir as you suggested, and I stumbled upon a very interesting file. The file is called StartVW.bmp and it looks like this:
                Click image for larger version

Name:	StartVW.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	9.7 KB
ID:	438479

                It is a very strange variant of this well known pick (called StartBenz.bmp):
                Click image for larger version

Name:	StartBenz.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	4.4 KB
ID:	438480

                So, maybe there a way to update the map files with the map files of the competitor of Mercedes

                Comment


                • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                  Originally posted by appelflap View Post
                  Thanks, I've dumped the bin file. You're right, it is ce 5.0 (old system btw). I'm gonna play with it and see what else the comand aps can do.
                  BTW i've dumped the bin files in the 5700_01 directory, not the 5600_01 dir as you suggested, and I stumbled upon a very interesting file. The file is called StartVW.bmp and it looks like this:
                  [ATTACH]415[/ATTACH]

                  It is a very strange variant of this well known pick (called StartBenz.bmp):
                  [ATTACH]416[/ATTACH]

                  So, maybe there a way to update the map files with the map files of the competitor of Mercedes
                  In DAS you have the option to change the bluetooth name from "MB bt" to "WV bt" or "VAN bt" so the same unit is also used in WV vans with a different front panel. The same unit seems to be used on some ACURA cars.

                  Did a quick check on WV
                  Code:
                  http://www.volkswagen-nutzfahrzeuge.de/etc/medialib/vwcms/virtualmaster/vwn_master/models/crafter/galerie.Par.0230.Image.jpg/cr0367.jpg
                  Same unit used by "WV Crafter"

                  What program did you use to decompile the bins?
                  Last edited by papars; 6th June 2010, 06:37.

                  Comment


                  • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                    Originally posted by papars View Post
                    In DAS you have the option to change the bluetooth name from "MB bt" to "WV bt" or "VAN bt" so the same unit is also used in WV vans with a different front panel. The same unit seems to be used on some ACURA cars.

                    Did a quick check on WV
                    Code:
                    http://www.volkswagen-nutzfahrzeuge.de/etc/medialib/vwcms/virtualmaster/vwn_master/models/crafter/galerie.Par.0230.Image.jpg/cr0367.jpg
                    Same unit used by "WV Crafter"
                    Great find... I searched a bit more and discovered that the unit is called RNS 5001

                    A set of new dvd's for this unit is more expensive than for the comand aps: 299 euro


                    What program did you use to decompile the bins?
                    I used the NKbin Toolset

                    BTW NK.bin contains the windows ce system files, and NK2.bin contains the specific application files..

                    Comment


                    • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                      Originally posted by appelflap View Post
                      Great find... I searched a bit more and discovered that the unit is called RNS 5001

                      A set of new dvd's for this unit is more expensive than for the comand aps: 299 euro



                      I used the NKbin Toolset

                      BTW NK.bin contains the windows ce system files, and NK2.bin contains the specific application files..
                      I think is called RNS 5010, see the PDF
                      Code:
                      http://www.vwbedrijfswagens.nl/media/images/vwbedrijfswagens/Modellen/Crafter/Prijslijst_%28PDF%29/prijslijst_crafter_apr10.pdf
                      The RNS 5001 is the older model with the buttons at the bottom of the screen and DVD map disk.

                      I wonder if we place the .bin files on a CD and ask the unit to perform a firmware upgrade ...
                      Last edited by papars; 6th June 2010, 09:40.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                        Originally posted by papars View Post
                        You can decompile the bin files using the usual microsoft or other tools find on the net. What I see as problem is how to force the unit to load these (modified) files without using DAS as is now. I suspect it might be possible using the hidden menu but it needs alot of reverse engineering or inside info.

                        The files aren't big about 80Mb total. You can find the telematics iso in this forum somewhere and then mount the iso to read them. But this is not the scope of this thread.

                        Regarding copy and image making of the map disks.
                        The original disks are pressed in PTP mode. Use DVDInfoPro to see what I mean.
                        This means that every copy made to OPT media is useless because there seems to be a copy protection that checks the layer brake position and maybe some other stuff.
                        ALL DVD+R DL disks are OPT. So forget every recording made to +R DL disks is simply not going to work.

                        I have no knowledge and can't make heads or tails about DVD-R disks from what I read on the net. In any case it seems there might be DVD-R disks that are PTP and these need special DVD recorders or / and software that knows how to handle the PTP disks correctly. [In playstations and other game machines, they use mod chips to force the units to read copied disks.]

                        One more thing I notice.
                        If you have old map, e.g. 1.0 and you upgrade the telematics then you can't load 1.1 or 3.0. You need to go straight to 4.1 because older maps needed older firmware to work. The stupid HU does not give you the correct message (about firmware mismatch) and just tells you to contact MB. IF you connect DAS then it will suggest the correct next update based on the telematcs installed on the HU.
                        Hi Papars
                        Nice work. After reading your post it seems that you have a very valid explanation of what is happening. I have ordered and I am waiting a new pair of NAVI 4.1 DVDs . Let us see what happens now . I will try to validate your findings and needless to say that I will be reporting back

                        All the best
                        George.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                          Thank you Gerry.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                            I wonder if is possible to run the image on win ce emulator ...

                            Did you had any luck finding the pin for "HDD protection" inside the above files?

                            Comment


                            • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                              Originally posted by papars View Post
                              I wonder if is possible to run the image on win ce emulator ...
                              good question. I'm going to try this in the near future.

                              Did you had any luck finding the pin for "HDD protection" inside the above files?
                              no, not yet

                              Comment


                              • Re: Mercedes Comand Aps 2009/2010 V4.1 NTG 2.5

                                Mercedes-Benz Navigations - DVD Comand APS (NTG2.5) 4.10 - 2010 - Rapidshare Link

                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389566549/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part001.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389597940/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part002.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389651786/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part003.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389689461/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part004.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389689464/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part005.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389689469/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part006.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389744792/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part007.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389752125/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part008.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389757803/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part009.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389768176/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part010.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389775498/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part011.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389782347/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part012.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389789619/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part013.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389796364/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part014.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389802782/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part015.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389809482/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part016.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389817390/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part017.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389824718/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part018.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389832345/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part019.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389842170/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part020.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389850833/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part021.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389859220/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part022.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389868093/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part023.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389878066/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part024.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389887087/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part025.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389895407/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part026.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389904515/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part027.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389912691/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part028.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389920893/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part029.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389954116/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part030.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389963365/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part031.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/389974096/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part032.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390248220/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part033.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390256820/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part034.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390265175/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part035.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390273784/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part036.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390282450/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part037.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390325797/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part038.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390515385/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part039.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390515419/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part040.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390543161/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part041.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390548926/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part044.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390548933/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part042.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390548942/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part043.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390548926/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part044.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390549630/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part045.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390550432/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part046.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390577544/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part047.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390638740/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part048.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390578183/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part049.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390579339/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part050.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390579804/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part051.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390603331/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part052.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390606573/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part053.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390606959/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part054.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390607121/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part055.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390632871/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part056.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390636090/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part057.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390636307/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part058.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390638751/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part059.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/391008361/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part060.rar
                                Code:
                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390909931/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part061.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390910198/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part062.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390911811/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part063.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390912380/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part064.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390935108/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part065.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390936974/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part066.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390938813/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part067.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390940476/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part068.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390965945/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part069.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390967526/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part070.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390968676/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part071.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/391008398/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part072.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390993750/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part073.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390994688/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part074.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/390995399/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part075.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/391173415/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part076.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/391156688/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part077.rar
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                                http://rapidshare.com/files/391157578/Mercedes-Benz_Navigations-DVD_Comand_APS__NTG2.5__4.10_-_2010.part078.rar
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